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Post by ScoutMom on Jan 6, 2009 22:39:12 GMT -6
It was suggested that I list the rules for my son's upcoming PWD. The weigh in and race are going to be on January 31st. So, not much time left. He has finished priming body and basecoating. Tomorrow he starts with the automotive paint (green). Extended wheels are allowed at our pack race but NOT at the District race, so we are not going to do extended wheel base-- gonna think positive about going to District again! LOL! The rules have all the "norms" (weight, length, width, etc). In addition to the dimensions, they have the following rules....
1. The wheels supplied with the kit must be used. The wheels may not be CUT, DRILLED, or ROUNDED. You MAY remove the SEAM from the wheels.
2. The axles supplied with the kit must be used. They may be polished or lubricated.
3. Wheel bearings, washers, or brushings are prohibited.
4. The car must not ride on any kind of springs
5. The car must be free wheeling with no starting devices.
6. No loose material of any kind, such as lead shot may be used.
7. The car body may have no moving parts.
8. Only dry lubricants are allowed.
That is about it. Pretty basic. I don't really know what they mean about the wheels not being rounded, but we sure as heck ARE going to machine them! I think it just means that you can not change the shape of them, like make them into an "H" configuration. I will ask the leader at our meeting on Monday-- just to get clarification.
I would imagine that our car will be looked at pretty closely this year, due to Ethan winning everything last year (including the award for best design). The woman that is heading our PWD does not like Ethan. Her son played baseball against Ethan and Ethan's team dominated. Then, she was supervising a camp out and Ethan gave her a hard time (he is a sweet kid, but he IS quite a hand full. He is VERY active-- does not tire out). I am not saying that she will be unfair about Ethan's car, but I bet that it would not break her heart to disqualify it. So-- I want to make sure that we follow ALL of the rules!
Any suggestions as to how we can increase speed while working with in the above parameters will be most appreciated! Also.... I keep reading about graphite lubricant, and every website says that THEIRS is the best! What is the scoop on graphite? Which is truly the best??? I know that ya'll must have opinions on that! I have read to stay away from the white teflon. And what is "moly"? Is that a kind of graphite? Please educate me!
Thanks bunches!!! Teresa "ScoutMom"
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lasound
Oil, Oil, Oil
www.derbydad4hire.com for Pinewood SPEED Supplies
Posts: 57
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Post by lasound on Jan 7, 2009 10:52:07 GMT -6
Scoutmom you have endless possiblities with those rules! 1. drill axle holes (rear wheels canted of course ) 2. run on 3 wheels. 3. inset a wheel into the center of the car. 4. setup a rail hugging car. Doing this will give you a huge advantage and i can teach you how to do any of these if you don't know. I am sure the other guys here have some more tricks up their sleeve that they will share. I prefer Hob-E-Lube on my cars. MaxV sells a good lube also and it is pretty close to HobELube. I will let the smarter guys here explain what Moly is.
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Post by Lucky 13 on Jan 7, 2009 12:02:42 GMT -6
Scoutmom,
Welcome to the PWDRacing forum !! You have found a great place to help you and your son build a fast pinewood derby. From your past results though, it sounds like you may already have a lot of it down !! I see your Pack allows extended wheelbase, but the District does not. Have you thought about just going with a short wheelbase car to begin with so that when the Pack race is over you are ready to go to District with the same car ? Well set-up short wheelbase cars can compete with extended wheelbase cars !! Does District allow you to relocate the axles/slots back but keep the 4 3/8 wheelbase ?
Do you know what type and length of track you will running on ? A rail rider would be the way to go depending on the type/style of track you have. DerbyWorx has a great video out showing the basics of setting up a rail rider. Here is a link to the video .
If we know the type and length of the track you will race on we can give you some suggestions on weight placement (com).
Graphite..I would say go with Hob-E-Lube !! The Max-V lube is suppose to be really great also. I've never used it, but there are a few racers here that do and they say it is great.
I would suggest looking around the forum and reading the info that has already been posted. If you have ANY questions, the racers here will be more than happy to help you out.
Lucky 13
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Post by ScoutMom on Jan 8, 2009 23:01:50 GMT -6
Hey, Guys! I am really happy to be getting such good advice! Ya'll are great. I just wanted to stress that I am looking for tips that my SON can use-- he wants to do this himself. Last year, he did so well because we bought all the parts that were prepped by someone else-- pre cut/weighted body, prepped wheels and axles. Basically we just painted and popped on the wheels. Now, don't get me wrong-- winning was AWESOME! It was so fun. But I have to admit that the victory felt a little less then completely "ours" because so much of the car was made by someone else. Do ya'll know what I mean? I wish that my son had done more of the car himself. And, this year he IS doing it himself! So I have to find a way to help him make his car competitive with out completely taking over the project!
We are definitely raising one wheel-- the car will have three wheels on the ground. We are discussing doing the "RAIL RIDER" trick. I tried to explain that to my son, but I am going to have to do some hands on with that one. If he will let me then we will do that because the track is an old WOODEN track (32 or 35 ft), and from what I have read the rail rider does best on the wooden tracks.That is correct, isn't it?
Since we are hoping to go to District where extended wheel base is NOT allowed, my son is doing his car with the regular wheel base. I am going to find out if we can drill new axle holes at District. I think that we can for the pack race, but I do not know for District.
Ok.... my question today is: on the RAIL RIDER, if we raise one of the front wheels (so the car is three wheels on the ground) then which wheel do we TURN ("cant"?) in? Do we adjust the other front wheel, or do we do one of the back wheels-- like the one opposite to the front wheel that is raised? I have it pictured in my mind that our front left wheel will be raised, and the back right wheel will be canted/truned inward so that it hits the rail. Is this correct, or am I totally screwing it up???
Regarding weight placement.... I thought that you always put the weight in the back of the car. Is that not correct??? Both the pack race and the District race are held on older wooden tracks (32 or 35 feet). Is putting the weight in the back the way to go with these tracks???
Thanks bunches! Teresa
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Post by ProQuest on Jan 9, 2009 0:06:55 GMT -6
Teresa,
The one front wheel that touches is the wheel that is turned to steer the car into the rail. It is critical that neither one of the rear wheels touch the center rail at any time, EVER.
Yes, the weight goes in the back. The completed car should balance at around 7/8" in front of the rear axle. Some of the league racers are far more aggressive placing the balance point (i.e. Center of gravity) as far back as 1/2" in front of the rear axle. But for a wooden track I would be far more conservative than that. 7/8" is relatively conservative, but still far more aggressive than 95% of the cars your son will face at the pack level.
I hope others will share their thoughts on this.
H
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Post by HyperDrive on Jan 9, 2009 9:57:14 GMT -6
Teresa, The one front wheel that touches is the wheel that is turned to steer the car into the rail. It is critical that neither one of the rear wheels touch the center rail at any time, EVER. Yes, the weight goes in the back. The completed car should balance at around 7/8" in front of the rear axle. Some of the league racers are far more aggressive placing the balance point (i.e. Center of gravity) as far back as 1/2" in front of the rear axle. But for a wooden track I would be far more conservative than that. 7/8" is relatively conservative, but still far more aggressive than 95% of the cars your son will face at the pack level. I hope others will share their thoughts on this. H Scoutmom, I concur with ProQuest In addition, I didn't See it mentioned but, just in case you're not aware, for a 4 3/8" wheel base use the end of the block that is closest to its axle location as the back of the car. Other than that all these guys are telling you the exact same things I would do. HyperDrive
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Post by sappingtonr on Jan 9, 2009 10:24:59 GMT -6
ScoutMom, Watch this video on RailRiding and Canting. It will help you put it all together:
If you haven't already, check out the derbyworx website, RacerX shows Videos on how to use all of the tools that are designed for scouts. They even sell them at the scout shops (some), however, I prefer the online vendors. I'm pretty sure that DerbyWorx has a link to all of the vendors on the Derbyworx website.
PM me if you need any help with that.
Sappington
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Post by Mayhem Miller on Jan 29, 2009 15:51:52 GMT -6
It sounds like your getting great advice from the other guys here, so i'm not gonna bore you with my input. I did want to say that I think its absolutely fantastic that your taking the time to learn about pinewood derby racing for your little boy, most moms wouldnt do the same.
The fact that your on this board, asking questions and learning shows what an amazing person you are. I hope you and your little boy do great at the race and have fun while winning!
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